Interview of Mable Wall Jones by Jean Hiatt and Diane Berkeley of the Ridge Street Oral History Project on February 10, 1995. (Oral History)

Biographical Information
Mable Jones moved with her mother to Ridge Street in 1957. She lived in the house there until 1994 when a rotten tree collapsed onto it and caused enough damage that the house had to be demolished. In this interview, she and her son Thomas Jones share their memories of Ridge Street and their lives growing up in Charlottesville. They talk about schooling, working in the area, and their involvement in their church, Mt. Zion Baptist Church.

Project Description
Race and Place is a project of the Virginia Center for Digital History and the Carter G. Woodson Institute for Afro-American and African Studies. The goal of the project is to chronicle the life of African-Americans in the Charlottesville, Virginia area during the period of segregation. As part of this project we have conducted a series of interviews with current residents of the Charlottesville area who were alive during that period. The project has also incorporated oral interviews conducted by other Charlottesville institutions which cover the appropriate subject area.

Notes About Our Transcription
The transcripts represent what was said in the interview to the best of our ability. It is possible that some words, particularly names, have been misspelled. Where we did not feel sure of spellings we have indicated this by the use of the term 'phonetically' in parentheses following the word in question. Places where words were unclear are noted by 'inaudible'. We have made no attempt to correct mistakes in grammar.

Q:Today is Friday, February 10, and this is Jean Hyatt and D. Berkley interviewing Mrs. Mable S. Jones, a longtime resident of 409 Ridge Street.
A:(Inaudible)
Q:Do you have any pictures, of when you were a child? (Inaudible)
A:No. Yes! Plenty of them.
Q:Plenty of them?
A:Yes, but they in the trashcan. My house went down.
Q:Oh!
A:Everything. Everything in my house went down.
Q:That's a, a major tragedy. Well, Mrs. Jones, were you born in Charlottesville?
A:No. I was born in Gordonsville, in Louisa County. Louisa County.
Q:When were you born?
A:July the 29th, 1909.
Q:1909? Oh. And then did you grow up (Inaudible)?
A:No. I came to Charlottesville when I was sixteen, and I went to Jefferson School.
Q:You went to Jefferson School?
A:(Indicates yes).
Q:And did you continue going there?
A:No. No. I quit in the eighth grade.
Q:Was that because it didn't continue - I know that -
A:No, I just quit!
Q:You just chose not to continue? I know that the school didn't - at one point didn't (Inaudible).
A:It's still going on.
(General chuckling)
Q:When you first - where did you live when you moved (Inaudible)
A:I lived - when I first come to Charlottesville, I lived on Dice Street. Dice Street.
Q:Das? D.A.S.?
A:D.I.C.E. Dice.
Q:Dice Street. I know that street. I said I'm familiar with that street. And then, at that point you started working?
A:No. I was sixteen. And I got married at age twenty. And I had lived in and out - I hadn't always lived in Charlottesville. I've lived in New York.
Q:(Inaudible).
A:Yes.
Q:So -
A:Let's see. Then I left Dice Street. (Pause several seconds) I don't know.
Q:When you moved from Dice Street, (Inaudible)?
A:No, No, No. I'm trying to think - Dice Street. I guess I moved in - well I used to - we used to go back and forth to Gordonsville in the summer, and then we'd come back to Dice Street. But when we left Dice Street, I guess I moved to Gordon Avenue and stayed there a few years.
Q:On Gordon Avenue? That's close to where I live. Um, your parents - were they - did they -
A:My mother - my father is dead. My mother is dead too. But my father died when I was ten years old, and my mother raised the five children. Three boys and two girls. Nobody left but Mable.
(General chuckling)
Q:What was your father's name?
A:Oscar.
Q:Oscar Jones?
A:No.
Q:Oh, no?
A:W.A.L.L.S.
Q:Wells?
A:Walls. And my mother's name was Dora Hughes Walls.
Q:And Hughes is a -
A:It's her maiden name. H.U.G.H.E.S.
Q:And were they - did they grow up in the Gordonsville area?
A:Mm-hm, mm-hm.
Q:So they - were they - was your home as a child - was it a place in the country?
A:Mm-hm.
Q:And did you have a farm-type situation, or was it a garden in the backyard, or something like that?
A:When I was a child?
Q:Uh-huh.
A:I reckon so. I can't even remember that far back. (Chuckle)
Q:I imagine most people had gardens.
A:Yeah I know my mother did. She - Yeah, we had a garden. In the country.
Q:Well - and so you were one of five children? And did your brothers and sisters stay in the area or did they wind up in other places?
A:They moved to other places.
Q:Outside of -
A:After they grew up they married. Yes. And they moved. One brother lived in Staunton, and one lived in Waynesboro, and one lived with Momma and me, on Ridge Street. We moved up, mm - I guess in 1957 was when we moved to (Inaudible) on Ridge Street. So then everybody's grown and married and away, and it's just my mother and me.
Q:So when - you, you moved to Ridge Street, you came with your mother. You and your mother -
A:My mother and I had always lived together.
Q:Uh-huh. And so you were - uh -
A:I'm the oldest of five children.
Q:You were grown up when you moved to Ridge Street?
A:Yeah, grown and married and had children. (Laughter)
Q:You had -
A:Two boys.
Q:Two boys.
A:James and Thomas. And my husband died in the '60s I think.
Q:Your husband died when?
A:In the '60s I believe, yeah.
Q:What was your husband's name?
A:James Jones.
Q:And what kind of - did he come from another area, or was he from Charlottesville?
A:He was from Simeons I think, wherever that is. Somewhere other than Charlottesville.
Q:Simeons?
A:Simeons.
Q:I don't know. Something like S.I.M.E.O.N.S. There's a, a orchard called Simeons. So he - (Inaudible)
A:But I met him in Charlottesville. I think Simeons's where he was born. (Inaudible)
Q:You met him in Charlottesville.
A:I met him in Charlottesville.
Q:Where, where - how did you meet him? Through, uh -
A:I don't know.
Q:Through the neighborhood or something? (Chuckle)
A:I don't know.
Q:How old were you when you got married?
A:Twenty. (Loudly) Twenty.
Q:Twenty? A young one.
Q:I was twenty.
Q:You were twenty too? (Laughter) I was a lot older. And, what kind of uh, work did he do?
A:He was a waitress. (Inaudible)
Q:At the Monticello Hotel?
A:Mm-hm.
Q:Which was, was that, the one - where's that?
Q:That's across from the courthouse.
A:Yeah, mm-hm.
Q:Which just closed, very recently.
Q:It's now I think apartments.
A:I think so, yeah. It's been so many years ago.
Q:It was a very fine restaurant. Did he work there - I mean, did he work there as a young man too, and continue to work there?
A:Mm-hm, until he left Charlottesville. He moved to New York.
Q:Uh-huh. And when did you start working? (Inaudible)
A:I started working when I was thirteen years old.
Q:Oh, no!
(General Laughter)
A:Just working all around.
Q:Did you -
A:But no, um, when I went to New York, I was a children's nurse in a private home. So, that's what I did. I had five kids, and then when I came back to Charlottesville, I worked as a domestic for Mrs. Claude Jessup for thirty-five years.
Q:Could you spell the name Claude Jessup?
A:Claude Jessup for thirty-five years.
Q:J.E.S.S.U.P. That's a famous name in Charlottesville.
Q:Did you say Claude or Clyde?
A:Claude.
Q:C.L.A.U.
A:D.E. Everybody ought to know him, he owns everything in Charlottesville. (Chuckle)
Q:I know the name. Actually D. is new to Charlottesville.
A:Aww!
Q:I've lived here a year now. I moved here last April. (Inaudible)
A:Oh, yes. Aw!
Q:The Jessups own the land where Seminole Square is now, right?
A:I don't know.
Q:I think that was (Inaudible).
A:But I know the Pepsi Cola plant, the City Laundry, the cemeteries. Just so much in Charlottesville that they own.
Q:That they own. No I think you're right. Where was their house where you worked?
A:Farmington. I started with them on Lewis Mountain Road, and then they lived in Farmington.
Q:How did you - how did you get out there everyday?
A:I had a ride.
Q:Oh. And you were there, like full-time.
A:Yeah, I was there five days a week.
Q:Uh huh. Well I know that's a well known family.
A:Yeah and she died last year. Her birthday was yesterday and I put flowers on the cemetery.
Q:Oh. So you were pretty good friends then?
A:Very close. Very close, yeah.(Inaudible).
Q:Um, so when you went to New York, how did you manage to do that? Did you know people there? Did you - how did you find that out?
A:Yes. There was a family that I met in Washington and I went to New York, and I worked up there about fourteen years.
Q:Oh fourteen years? (Inaudible)
A:I cared for the children. And then I came back to Charlottesville.
Q:And when you were doing -
A:When my -
Q:You were married at the time?
A:Yeah but I was divorced, at uh, my husband died in '60s, that means divorce was - (Inaudible).
Q:So you were married, and then divorced, and then went to New York?
A:No I divorced while I was in New York.
Q:Uh-huh. Your uh, - what kind of work did your father do?
A:My father died in 19 and 20, I was ten years old. So I can't tell you what he did.
Q:That's a sad thing when parents die early.
A:Uh-huh. Yeah and I was young. But I think my mother said he was a railroad man. I think. And my mother was a seamstress. She used to make clothes for everybody (Chuckle) in Charlottesville almost.
Q:Oh that's great.
A:She got her diploma. I guess that went down with the house too. Um, but he worked on the railroad, and my mother was a dressmaker.
Q:Well, there's quite a few people that worked on the railroad. Virginia Ross had family, or her, her husband worked -
A:Yeah, yeah my father did. My momma said.
Q:So when you moved to Ridge Street, that was, you said, was in the '50s.
A:Mm-hm.
Q:And was it - did you move directly to 409 Ridge Street? So you've been there forever then?
A:Until the tree went down. Fifty some years.
Q:It was a wonderful house.
A:It was. A beautiful home.
Q:Can you tell us a little bit about the house? I saw it from the outside, but what was it like on the inside?
A:Very nice.
Q:How many rooms did you have?
A:I had, I guess, fourteen rooms in all.
Q:That's a big -
A:Yes. Big house. Lots of closets, hardwood floors and everything. It was beautiful!
Q:There was a -
A:(Coughing) Inside we had a fireplace in the hall, a fireplace upstairs, and we had, I think we had about three fireplaces, but I never used them. (Inaudible) Mantelpieces, beautiful mantelpieces in the hall and the living room, and in a upstairs bedroom. The mantles.
Q:It was - I've been told it was the oldest house on Ridge Street.
A:That's what they say.
Q:(Inaudible)
A:(Inaudible) (Coughing)
Q:Can you tell me about the little - the little, the building behind, in the backyard?
A:That - that's a cottage back there. That has three rooms and a shower.
Q:Do you think it was a kitchen at one time, or did anyone say anything about that? Used to have in the older houses, used to have a - have a kitchen separate from the main house.
A:No. It wasn't separate.
Q:That was saved though. You were next door to the (Hartman's?), the Gibsons, Beverly Gibson (Inaudible)
A:Mm-hm. Yeah but they weren't there when I, when we bought that.
Q:They arrived shortly after the war I guess.
A:I remember when my mother speak of the Hartmans (phonetically) and there was somebody else over there, I don't know, that made potato chips. I can't think who they were, though. On Ridge Street.
Q:(Inaudible) potato chip factory, or -?
A:No, it wasn't a factory. No. Just a home. I was very young. I was living on Dice Street then, but I remember.
Q:So there was a lot of businessmen - there were a lot of businesspeople that lived on Ridge Street at one time?
A:Yes.
Q:Well, when you went to - when you were on Dice Street and Ridge Street, did you - you - which church did you -
A:Mt. Zion has always been my church. I joined Mr. Zion when I came to Charlottesville.
Q:Uh-huh. And this is still a very active church?
A:Yes.
Q:How about shopping, where did you - what stores were available, like, for groceries and so forth? Where did you go? Early, in the early times.
A:I don't know in the early times. I guess my mother did the shopping. (Chuckling)
Q:When - how about in the - when you moved to Ridge Street in the '50s, did you -
A:Yeah, I used to deal with the style shop and the young men's shop, and whatever grocery store there was down on the mall, now, I used to shop there. M.C. Thomas.
Q:St. Thomas?
A:(Loudly)M.C. Thomas. Grand Piano now, isn't it? Yeah, that's what they call.
Q:But it says M.C. Thomas, I think, on the building.
A:Yes, uh-huh. I used to shop with them in the '50s.
Q:That was what kind of store?
A:Furniture.
Q:Furniture?
A:Yeah. Grand Piano furniture store. And the style shop was a ladies clothing store.
Q:The Style shop?
A:The Style shop. Uh-huh.
Q:And that was right down, like, where the mall is now?
A:It used to be. Uh-huh.
Q:How about, where did you - did you ever use the - weren't there some little tiny grocery stores on Ridge Street?
A:Not that I know of.
Q:I guess toward where Hartmans Mills Road is.
A:No.
Q:That might have been before you moved here, that they had those stores.
A:Well it could have been, but I don't go down, you know - but uh, Mrs. Dawson lived down on that end of Ridge Street, but I don't know -.
Q:Then she was -
A:- much. Then she moved to 413 before I did.
Q:She was there before you?
A:Mm-hm.
Q:(Inaudible) Tell us some things about the - that neighborhood or at least the several blocks that - where you lived. Did you get to know most of the people?
A:I knew most of the people on that block. Mrs. Ophelia Smith, and Mrs. Safronia Jackson, Mrs. Elizabeth Dawson.
Q:Mrs. Ophelia Smith -
A:Mrs. Safronia Jackson.
Q:How do you spell that? (Chuckling)
A:S.A.F.R.O.N.I.A..
Q:S.A.F.-
A:R.O.N.I.A., Jackson. She's there now.
Q:Oh. And is she a long-time resident also?
A:Yes.
Q:And Mrs. Elizabeth -
A:Dawson.
Q:And that's who we, she's been interviewed hasn't she? But, when you first moved to Ridge Street, that was before some of the buildings were taken down, before they expanded Cherry Avenue, so what - can you sort of tell us about what it looked like?
A:I don't know, because I wasn't here long enough to pay attention. I was going back and forth. Where I worked in New York, she was a writer, and if she would write and call and say, would you come up for six months or a year or what, take care of the children while I write, and I'm gone, so, things happened on Ridge Street that I didn't know about until I come home, and my mother or somebody would tell me, but I just don't know.
Q:You were moving around quite a bit?
A:Yes. Yes. My brother told me once that I had bought the Pennsylvania Railroad (Interviewer laughs), because I used to ride the train all the time. But all of those people that I knew there were very nice. And all of us went to the same church and everything.
Q:How about - how has Ridge Street changed in the last twenty years or so?
A:Don't ask me honey. (Chuckling) I don't know.
Q:Well, some other time. It's gotten - seems like it's gotten, did lose, you know, some of the nice buildings. Down Ridge Street.
A:Yeah. Where were the buildings? In my block?
Q:One block down where Cherry Avenue -
A:Yeah well see I don't know down like that.
Q:(Inaudible) So Nolan's was built on Ridge Street, did that happen when you were -
A:Nolan's? Was it, Tom?
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible)
A:I don't know. Nolan's was built (Inaudible).
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible)
Q:But they took down some nice houses, I think, (Inaudible) - Were you going to say something?
Mr. Jones:No I'm just trying to think back now. I think uh, I'm trying to think what was on the corner, see Nolan's was where the (new museum?) is now. Since we were there. '57. (Inaudible) I'm trying to think what was on the corner there. (Inaudible) It wasn't a funeral home I'm pretty sure. And John (Inaudible)he lived cross the street there.
A:When what?
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible) the store right there. You know I worked with John (Inaudible) his house. When we were first there. When I go back in the service. (Inaudible)
A:I don't know. Tell me about it, I don't know (Chuckle). Tell me about it, I don't know.
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible)
Q:Well, what uh, I was going to ask about your son. What kind of work have you been, did you do, and (Inaudible)?
Mr. Jones:Well uh, I worked at the University for a while when I first came out of the service, then I worked at - I was a cook at Cedars Nursing Home, the one that's out on Barracks road. Then I worked for Greencroft Nursery. I don't know where that's located now, and I also worked for E.C. Ferron, which is a -
A:Construction firm.
Q:Oh construction. E.C. Ferron? F.-?
Mr. Jones:Ferron. Yeah, Allied bought them out. It's HFE.R.R.O.N.
A:Who's H.E.?
Mr. Jones:Ferron. F.E.R.R.O.N.
A:Oh yeah, F.
Mr. Jones:Allied bought them out.
Q:So you were in the service?
Mr. Jones:Yes, ma'am.
Q:So what - what years were you in the service?
Mr. Jones:Uh, '50 - '51. I was wounded, that's the reason I didn't stay that long.
Q:You said you worked at uh, Sears?
Mr. Jones:Cedars.
Q:Cedars?
A:Nursing Home.
Mr. Jones:It was right off of Barracks road. (Inaudible) I was the morning cook over there. That's, I worked in Charlottesville, for about, I spent quite a time away from here, quite a bit of time here. But most of my work was in Coopersville, except once I drove a -
Q:You were a cook.
A:(Chuckling) Yeah, a cook.
Mr. Jones:I drove a (Inaudible) trucks for a while, in Washington, but most of my other time I was cooking.
Q:So this is why - this is lucky for you that he could cook, huh?
(General Laughter)
(Inaudible)
Q:And you have, your other son?
A:He died. My mother died in 1978, in August, and my son died in 1978 in December.
Q:That was an unhappy year then. And you had -
A:And my mother was ninety-six years old.
Q:Ninety-six? Well that's pretty wonderful.
A:Isn't it though?
Q:Long lived.
A:Yes.
Q:Pretty remarkable. Did, you and she spent the whole, your whole lives together?
A:We lived together, yes.
Q:That's really (Inaudible)
A:When I left New York, I came home to take care of my mother.
Q:Did - you said you were, you always attended Mt. Zion. What kind of entertainment activities did you enjoy? Was it -
A:I was a Sunday school teacher, and I sang in the choir. And I belonged to the Industrial Club.
Q:Industrial?
A:Club.
Q:Was that connected with the church?
A:Oh yes, that's a club in the church. The Daughters of Ruth, that's in the church, and the Missionary Society. (Inaudible) So I was busy.
(Laughter)
Q:What did the Daughters of Ruth do?
A:Well, (Inaudible), men and young women, and we talked and, you know, and we would go around and visit the sick, put on programs, we used to put on a lot of programs, and we got a lot of things for the church that the Daughters of Ruth did. Don't ask me what 'cause I've forgotten. But we did a lot, the Daughters of Ruth. The Industrial Club -
Q:It's kind of like a service club (Inaudible).
A:The Industrial Club, I'm an honorary member there now. But they just take care of the sick. And the missionary (Inaudible)
Q:(Inaudible) plus I'm sure there's (Inaudible) social as well.
A:Yeah.
Q:So are - do you still participate in some of those organizations?
A:Mm-hm. I'm an honorary member of the Industrial Club, but I'm still in the Daughters of Ruth. I don't attend all the meetings - I'm eighty-five years old and with lung cancer, I just take it easy, do what I have to do. Take it easy. Take it easy. I go to Sunday School and church when I can.
Q:Well when, when the weather's bad.
A:'Cause the bus comes right past here.
Q:Oh, it does?
A:Uh-huh. Mt. Zion bus. And the, if the weather's nice I go, every Sunday. Go to Sunday School, and stay to church.
Q:And it's, that's a nice program. I attended a program there recently at the Martin Luther King memorial service. It was very nice.
A:Yeah, I was there in all that rain, and gloom.
Q:Uh-huh, good for you! (Chuckle)
A:But it was nice.
Q:Did - tell us about when the trees came down (Inaudible).
A:(Inaudible) when the trees came down, it was on the Monday, no I guess, or a Tuesday, I don't know but anyhow, around 10:30, and I had breakfast heating in the stove, and had come back out of the kitchen and was sitting in my room reading the bible, and I heard this boom noise. And I got up, and my niece was in another room across from me, and she - we met in hall - and she said, what was that? And I said, I don't know. And I looked out the front door and I looked out the back door, and we were trapped. We were trapped in by branches. The lady at the day-care called to see if I was all right. And I said, fine! Call somebody. (Laughter)
Q:(Laughter) The phone was working and everything?
A:Yes it was. And I said, call somebody. And she said, okay. And a few minutes, everybody in Charlottesville was there from the fire department and all. And there were men working on up -(Tape stopped briefly)
Q:Was there an attic in the house?
A:No. No.
Q:Second floor. And, and there you saw it, next to you? Or, -
A:No. No.
Q:Did you see it? The tree?
A:I - when the tree fell, I heard this noise. My niece and I met in the hall, "what is that?" I looked out the front door and all I could see was limbs, but I didn't know what it was. And I couldn't get to - and I went to the side door. There were branches, and we were trapped in there.
Q:So the tree didn't -
A:It came over the kitchen, smashed the kitchen in (Chuckle), and some of the ceiling from the dining room fell. But, I couldn't see the tree from the back, you know, from in the house. 'Cause, it fell - it came down in the kitchen. And I was not in the kitchen. The Lord had told me to get out of that kitchen and go in my room, and that's where I was when the tree fell. And these men -
(Inaudible from other person present)
Q:It didn't?
A:It didn't. Now that I think of it, but at first, I was just as happy. It was shock. That's all, that's right, it was shock. But these men -
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible) Salvation Army (Inaudible)
A:- three - two men working for the city came and - Shhh! (to Mr. Marshall who is talking while she is talking) -
Mr. Jones:Yes ma'am.
Q:You've got more information for us.
A:- these men working for the city came up and broke a window, and lifted me and my niece out through that window.
Q:Oh my god.
Q:Was this in a terrible -
A:No wind. No wind. No nothing. Beautiful. A beautiful day.
Q:What caused - it became - (Inaudible).
A:They said that when the tree fell - they said that it was rotten on the inside. But from the outside, you couldn't say that.
Q:It looked good?
A:Yes. Yes.
Q:So it was just the tree was, was rotting away? (Inaudible) It was a very big tree. I took have pictures of it, actually.
A:You did?
Q:Would you like some?
A:Yes.
Q:I'm sure you would.
A:Oh, that's the biggest tree.
Q:It was enormous. It was a beautiful tree.
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible)
A:Yes, it was. It was. Beautiful. Yes. But it - and Mrs. Dawson wasn't home when this happened. She was out shopping. So when she came home, here I am in her yard, and all these people in her yard. And she, somebody met her outside before she came to the house, to tell her what had happened, so she wouldn't have a heart-attack.
Q:Oh, good. Were you able to save much furniture or?
A:No, no. Not too much. The upstairs, I had two rooms, actually three rooms of things that I could not get, and clothing and furniture.
Q:Oh that's awful. You couldn't get it because it was too dangerous?
A:Yes. They didn't want us to, because they didn't know -
Q:Yes sir?
Mr. Jones:I just had a thought, just came to me. (Inaudible) Okay, there was a white house on that corner, it had a very big tall yard to it, and it had a cottage in the back, just like the (Inaudible). A weather built house (Inaudible).
A:I don't know nothing about that.
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible)- call Mrs. Dawson and ask her. I remember (Inaudible) before the war. And they had a cottage in the back like we did. But the yard was way up in the air. They cut that yard down when (Inaudible). (Inaudible) down to the Street. (Inaudible).
Q:(Inaudible) just very sad. Thank you for finding that out.
Q:Just flattened down?
Q:Took the land right out. Well I know you're glad -
A:And some of my dishes in the dining room, because the ceiling, you know, continued to fall and we were afraid to go in there because you didn't know what was going to fall on your head. So some of my dishes I didn't get.
Q:Did they send anybody in there to get as much as they could though?
A:Yes. My grandchildren went in there and got what they could, but -
Q:It sounds like (Inaudible) earthquakes. The same situation, they wouldn't let you go -
A:No, they wouldn't. They had the yellow ribbons all around, right.
Q:Well, when they demolished the house, did you watch that, or -
A:No. No, no, no.
Q:It was too depressing. Well when they did it -
A:I saw some of it, I was over there. But they didn't demolish the house until after I had gone, left Mrs. Dawson's.
Q:Right. They waited to see if it would stand.
A:Yeah. But I would go over some days, and I (Inaudible). But I didn't see it when they got the tree off. I didn't see that.
Q:That took a long time to take the tree off.
A:Long time, mm-hm. There was a lot of wood there too. (Chuckle)
Q:Tragedy, for that to happen.
A:Yeah.
Q:There was a man in my building who was cutting down, I guess a couple of years ago, cutting down a tree, with a chainsaw, and I guess he was - didn't really know how to do this, because it (Sound of phone) - the tree he cut down knocked down another tree, as I understand it, and it fell on him, and he is - both his arms and legs were paralyzed, you know, and he was crushed under this (Inaudible).
A:He was crushed?
Q:Yes. He survived, but he's paralyzed.
A:Yes, uh-huh. Aww. That's tragic. Yeah that is dangerous. I am - I could have been in, walking in my backyard when that tree went down. Did you see how that -
Q:I saw it - I went over to Oak Street and looked.
A:Uh-huh, and I usually - and he was downtown when that happened.
Q:Your son was?
A:Uh-huh. And I usually sit on the front porch all the time in the summer, and when he came home and saw this tree, somebody had to grab him because he almost came screaming. Because he just knew that I was on that porch, under the tree. Thank the Lord -
Q:It was a relief.
A:It was. Yeah. It was something.
Q:Is that one of the most frightening things that ever happened to you, closest you've come -
A:That ever happened to me. Mm-hm. But, like we were saying, I didn't get excited, I was just laughing and acting crazy and all. But after it all over - after it was all over, I started thinking how blessed I was that I didn't get hurt and I started thinking about things that could have happened to me, you know. But right at that minute, think nothing (Inaudible).
Q:Do you miss living over there?
A:I certainly do.
Q:Terribly.
A:Yes. I had been over there so long. And with Mrs. Dawson, my neighbor, we would run - we had a path that we would run from one house to the other.
Q:You beat a path?
A:Yes. And I certainly do miss that.
Q:She says she miss - she feels lonely with that empty space, and not having you there.
A:I know. She's - she's, yes.
Q:It was a wonderful, mutual relationship -
A:- relationship we had.
Q:Well now at least you can talk on the phone and still go over there.
A:And go over. I do. Yes.
Q:And she took care - you stayed with her for a few weeks?
A:About three weeks. Then when I left there, I went and stayed with my daughter-in-law for about three weeks.
Q:She's in -
A:Charlottesville. Mm-hm, on 9th Street. Carmilla. And I stayed with her three weeks, and then we started looking for a place to live, and this was all I could find right then.
Q:I think it's good to find someplace close. Nearby . . . so you can see her. Well, getting back to some other questions about life on Ridge Street, where did you go when you were sick? Did you have a doctor nearby?
A:What do you mean, when I was sick?
Q:Well a doctor, did you have a doctor nearby?
A:Oh, Dr. Jennings was my doctor.
Q:Dr. Jones?
A:Jennings. And I'd go to him, to his office, yes.
Q:Was he a long-term doctor?
A:As far as I know, yes. I've had him for a long time. Dr. Jennings. And he's still my doctor.
Q:Did you go to - you were talking about going to Martha Jefferson, is that where you would go instead of the University?
Q:(Inaudible) - my grandson was born, ten years ago.
A:Martha Jefferson? Yes. Ohh. My children were born in University Hospital.
Q:Were you born at home, yourself?
A:Uh-huh, I guess, I'm not sure.(Chuckle) Yes I was born at home.
Q:Now it's changed, well now they push people out of the hospital in a very quick fashion. Used to be you could stay there a few days when you had children, but now, it's very short-term.
A:Yeah, that's what I hear. I heard that. Yes. I think I stayed there about two weeks.
Q:Oh that's nice, that's what my mother did. Two weeks.
Q:Three weeks?
Q:Two weeks.
Q:Oh mine was three weeks. She was perfectly healthy, no problems. Three weeks (Inaudible).
A:Yeah yeah. And then come home and stayed.
(Laughter)
Q:Relax.
A:Yeah. For another two weeks. Yeah.
Q:Well, that sounds like fun to me. Well, when the Civil Rights Movement came along, did you get involved in that?
A:Mm-hm, I used to go to some of their meetings and marches.
Q:Oh, you did? Good. How about you? Did you get involved in the Civil Rights Movement or were you too young?
Mr. Jones:Well, I was - no, I wasn't here. I didn't get around too much. I had my hip replaced twice and I was just able to get around myself. (Inaudible). I couldn't do any walking.
Q:Uh-huh, so your mom had to do it?
(Laughter)
Mr. Jones:Well yes. I had my hip replaced twice in two years. Same hip.
Q:Same hip? When was that?
A:Well that was just here lately.
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible)
Q:Was the activity - was the church active? Did you get active in -
A:In the Civil Rights Movement? Yes, yes. (Inaudible).
Q:The Mount Zion -
Q:So you say you went on marches. Where?
A:Well we marched from downtown, downtown. Some church down - downtown, up until Mt. Zion church. Just short. Real short. Just one Sunday. Just one Sunday. You know, I didn't go to Washington Park. We just walked down. The church was real nice from one church to another.
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible) - down to Tonsler Park.
A:Not me. No.
Q:Some other people huh?
A:Yeah a lot of people.
Q:Did you - were there - I don't know about this but were there any sort of famous people that came to Ridge Street that you know about that stayed at people's homes or maybe were involved in the Civil Rights Movement?
A:Mm-mm. No. Not that I know of. Not that I know of.
Mr. Jones:Yeah. What was his name, he came here one time. (Inaudible).
Q:I know Jesse Jackson has been here, but that's fairly recent.
A:Yeah but I can't think of anybody.
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible) he was a kind of older fellow (Inaudible)
Q:Oh I know who you're talking about. That's recent. Dick Gregory (Phonetically). That was like three or four years ago. I went on that march. That was good. And it ended out at Tonsler Park. I know him. I have a picture of myself standing next to him in fact.
A:Oh, you do? Hmm.
Q:Did you have some questions to ask?
Q:No, I can't think of any.
Q:How about when your family bought the Ridge Street house? Was that the first time that you purchased a house, or was that back in Gordonsville and then Dice Street?
A:No. No.
Q:It was harder for African Americans to (Inaudible) -
A:The first house that we owned was on - the first house - the first house we owned was Parrot Street. Now it's another name. Yeah but it was Parrot Street.
Q:How do you spell that?
A:P.A.R.R.O.T. Yeah.
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible)
A:No. No. That's way back Thomas. Parrot Street is down there off of the cemetery. Down in there.
Q:Okay. Uh-huh.
Q:What's your name?
A:Thomas Marshall Jones..
Q:Mable, what does S. stand for, Mable?
A:Serena.
Q:Serena. Oh that's (Inaudible).
A:That's what my momma said.
Q:That's her middle name. How do you spell that?
A:S.E.R.E.N.A. My mother did all spelling. M.A.B.E.L. . . . M.A.B.L.E. She spelled it. M.A.B.L.E. was the way my momma spelled it. Some people spell it differently.
Mr. Jones:Didn't your brothers use that middle name. (Laughter) I don't remember, they never used it.
Q:So you bought the house on Parrot Street, and then came to Dice, and then Ridge?
A:I didn't own anything on Dice Street.
Q:Oh, that was your parents that had that. Was it hard to borrow money from the bank?
A:I didn't buy that house on Parrot Street. My brother gave it to my mother, and my mother sold it, and we bought on Ridge Street. And we had no trouble with the mortgage or anything because momma put the money from the house that she sold on Ridge Street.
Q:That was a nice gift.
A:It was - my brother gave it to my mother.
Q:Wonderful.
Q:You said that you started working when you were thirteen. As a baby-sitter or?
A:No, I think I used to wash dishes for somebody (Chuckle) in a home, and go to school. It's been so long ago.
Q:So when you left school, you were glad to leave school, or -
A:Yeah because I wanted to get a better job and help my mother. She had raised five children and I'm being the oldest and only ten or twelve when my father died. So she had, my mother had a lot of responsibility.
Q:You were the youngest?
A:I'm the oldest.
Q:The oldest of five.
A:Of five.
Q:And you're the only one still living? What kind of work did you do during those years, from the time you left school until you got married?
A:I just said, taking care of children.
Q:Oh that was when you were (Inaudible). This is all on tape so I'm writing it so if I don't understand something you can check it.
A:That's all right.
Q:Then your - did your brother stay in Charlottesville that gave your mother the house?
A:No.
Q:He went on.
A:He went to service. And when he came home from service, he lived in Staunton, Virginia, and he gave my mother the house then. He gave my mother that house when he came out of service. He bought it. And that was her baby. And that was her baby.
Q:No kidding. Shows a lot of love. So the children loved their mother quite a bit.
A:Yes. Yes. All of them, all of them. All the children.
Q:What church did you go to when you lived out in Gordonsville?
A:Oak Grove. Oak Grove Baptist Church.
Q:Do you know if it's still there?
A:No it isn't. I think they merged with some other church.
Q:But the church was a big part of your life all along?
A:While I was, you know, growing up, and lived down in Gordonsville. But I came to Charlottesville when I was sixteen. My mother moved to Charlottesville. But we would go back and forth. Summer in the country, and winter in Charlottesville.
Q:Huh, pleasant (Chuckle). And did you still have relatives in Gordonsville area? So it'd be a pleasant place to go back.
A:Yes, we had my home down there.
Q:And, your family, you kept it? (Inaudible) Did you come to Charlottesville because it was more work? Is that why your mom -
A:Yes, because, mm-hm. And the schools were better for the children. She moved.
Q:Better schools. Did you go to the - You were still going to the ele - at ten years old, oh no, sixteen, there was another elementary school that was next to Jefferson.
Mr. Jones:Both of them were named Jefferson.
Q:Oh, they both liked the same name. Where did you go to school?
Mr. Jones:I went to Mechanicsville. That's down in Louisa County. I went to Jefferson. I went to Christianburg Industrial Institute. That's over in Christianburg.
Q:Uh-huh. Industrial Institute. Is that - did you get sort of, did you learn about cooking there, or did you just learn that on your own?
Mr. Jones:No I didn't. I didn't. (Inaudible) - my brothers (Inaudible). Oh the name of Parrot Street is Oakmont, used to be Parrot Street. That's down off of (Inaudible), between Oak and Dice (Inaudible).
Q:Okay. Good, thank you.
Q:What was your other son's name?
A:James.
Q:And his - he did some cooking too? He was a chef or a cook?
A:James? I guess. (Inaudible) He did a lot of -
Mr. Jones:(Inaudible) - on Rugby Road. And I was a baker's second. And he was a cook's second. And we kind of got (Inaudible) during the school time, school years.
Q:Oh at one of the fraternities or -
Mr. Jones:Well there was a townhouse - on Rugby Road the old brick apartments, I think it was an apartment there. The basement used to be Rugby cafeteria.
Q:Oh no kidding? I didn't know that. There are beautiful old apartments out there. Is, there's one on, is that Gordon Avenue?
Mr. Jones:No this is Rugby Road. If you cross the bridge, coming from, going from the north or south, yeah south, going that way, you cross the bridge and it's right on the left hand side (Inaudible) down at the bottom.
Q:Oh okay. When you moved to Ridge Street, did you, that was the time when there was, African American families were moving in, and some white families were leaving? Did you find -
A:No problem. No problem.
Q:white families, reacting negatively or was it sort of -
A:No, not to me. No problem.
Q:Oh. That's good. People were pretty courteous and -
A:In my - up in my - in the 400 block - I had no trouble. (Inaudible) Mm-hm.
Q:Well I think some people moved out, from what I understand was just because the houses were big, and their children were grown, and more businesses coming in, that affected the change. Is there some things that you would like to add to this? Other thoughts on Ridge Street?
A:No. I just miss my home on Ridge Street. (Inaudible) (Laughter)
Mr. Jones:Wouldn't mind having three bedrooms on one floor, wouldn't have to go upstairs. (Inaudible).
A:He wouldn't mind having a home with three bedrooms so that I wouldn't have to go up and down the steps.
Q:Are you renting this house -
A:Yes. No I'm too old to buy anything now.
Q:That was, the timing on that tree falling down, that was pretty terrible.
A:Yeah, but I don't intend to stay here. Ma'am?
Q:What was the date, of the, what date?
A:I think it was about the 22nd of August. That's when the tree fell.
(Inaudible)
Q:I brought the clipping in.
A:Yeah I think it was the 22nd of August. I think it was the 22nd of August.
Q:So you hoped that - you planned that, this is a temporary situation.
A:Yes.
Mr. Jones:22nd of August. (Inaudible).
A:All right! (Chuckle)
Q:Well, I appreciate very much you talking with us. And thank you -
A:Sorry I can't give you enough.
(Thereupon this interview was concluded.)

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Virginia Center for Digital History, University of Virginia
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